LIHKG [耳機撚]召集大耳牛、枱式耳機系統用家(96)
我係打手 2024-8-11 12:08:50
:^(

問推薦唔俾budget一律建議dCS vivaldi APEX/MSB Select DAC 成set加HE-1
隔離耳機po剩係得隨身玩家,hifi po 又主要都係玩speaker , 乜香港地無人玩over-ear, on-ear 耳機咩
:^(

吐槽:其實隔離post唔係淨係得隨身玩家,不過隨身玩法洗版太快,好難追到headphone 啲comment
:^(

呢度會集中headphone 同埋枱式系統相關(包括DAC, AMP)
IEM, 綜合: "[耳機撚] 討論各大耳機店及耳機"
TWS 入耳: "True Wireless真無線耳機討論"
無線headphone: "True Wireless頭戴式耳機討論"
喇叭: "[音響撚]音響HIFI討論區"
soundbar, 家庭影音: "Soundbar及家庭影院的抉擇,求解答"

Post 1 to 95, search for "[耳機撚]召集大耳牛、枱式耳機系統用家"

快快地聽,慢慢地說,慢慢地動怒
reply之前唔好心急,review一下就會避到唔少爭執
一去到意氣之爭就好難將你想表達論點令人聽得入耳

初心係音樂
唔係器材


Template完善中,歡迎comment
Glossary
ASIO
From wiki:
ASIO(Audio stream input output),音頻設備驅動程序的一種。

用ASIO目的係做低延遲,同埋避開OS個volume control
OS個volume control會resample個audio去做volume control,音質會差咗
ASIO要hardware support,唔少要裝driver的 DAC都已經有ASIO support
ASIO4All其實唔算真ASIO

WASAPI
WASAPI係用作避開Windows audio core 個 resampling.
用Exclusive mode(獨佔 mode)之下software可以要求獨佔個audio device (e.g. DAC),其他program 唔可以同時用同一部dac出聲,而且唔經resampling
所有 program 預設用Shared mode,將唔同program 聲resample 再mix 埋先出dac
傳送audio data個時會有push mode 同 event mode揀

event mode vs push mode
push mode 下program keep住定期問DAC幾時可以收data,等到DAC 答ready 就send data比 DAC。部份DAC有機會因為buffer問題而有decode 問題
Event mode 之下program 準備部份data,等DAC 自己向program 問program data,program先會send data。Latency 會低過push mode。
Event mode 要DAC support先用到。

CTIA, OMTP
兩種唔同3.5 mm 有mic頭標淮,夾錯標淮的話用6.3 轉3.5轉頭個時會冇聲
:^(


dBFS
電路訊號強度單位

LKFS
人耳所聽到的loudness level單位,並非電路訊號強度

MMCSS
Multimedia Class Scheduler service (MMCSS) 係windows內有關多媒體CPU schedule服務,對於播放軟件,用高d priority就少d機會同人爭resource
"Pro Audio"為最高priority
foobar 2000同TuneBrowser都可以set MMCSS做"Pro Audio"

Drop.com (前稱 massdrop)
Drop 係一個外國團購網,上面有唔同分類產品,包括服裝、電器、科技產品、Gaiming產品等等。同呢個post最有關就係audiophile分類
URL: https://drop.com/audiophile/drops
IEM, headphone, dac, amp, ear pad/ ear tip都有

平至幾十到過萬港紙產品都有,每個產品都可以留言討論同review;購物區以外亦有forum比用家交流。
(當然,review同討論就好個人,只供參考)

Drop 買野唔ship 香港的話可以用轉運,如buyandship

Drop 運作方式係同廠方合作推團購,有時會用massdrop (or Drop) 冠名同廠方推出Drop 限定特別版產品。好似HD 6XX (即係HD650)

MQA
It is a scam.
https://youtu.be/pRjsu9-Vznc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHkqWZ9jzA0
https://goldensound.audio/2021/11/29/tidal-hifi-is-not-lossless/

工具
https://www.audiocheck.net/soundtests_headphones.php
呢個 website主要 gen啲tune 出嚟 check frequency response , 左右聲度同左右有冇反相之類
唔只耳機, 試喇叭都會用得
check 有冇左右反相重可以用下面呢條 youtube 片, 佢會話你知幾時段音樂會刻意反咗相:
https://youtu.be/kUT6ZhFdLkA

http://www.digizoid.com/headphones-power.html
https://www.headphonesty.com/headphone-power-calculator/
headphone power calculator, 可以用黎計headphone 要幾多watt / 電壓先夠推

FAQ
Frequency response 與聽感關系
:^(


discrete amp vs chip based amp
chip based amp係用op amp砌出黎
op amp 人面有完整放大線路
你將個放大線路用返普通transistor砌出黎就係discrete amp
當然你所有野拆出黎做就所有野都可以customise, 技術高就可以做得好過op amp
op amp 有個缺點係出唔到大電流,出大電流就要拆開做

op amp就好似notebook/all in 1 PC, discrete amp 就好似自己砌機咁

真空管認識入門
https://hifiprosumer.com/2021/08/21/tube-intro/

iPhone夠推HD800s?
[耳機撚]召集大耳牛、枱式耳機系統用家(57)
- 分享自 LIHKG 討論區
https://lih.kg/aLDpBxV

IFI英國公司?
https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/%E5%BA%99%E5%B0%8F%E5%A6%96%E9%A3%8E%E5%A4%A7%EF%BC%8C%E6%B1%A0%E6%B5%85%E7%8E%8B%E5%85%AB%E5%A4%9A-%E5%90%84%E5%93%81%E7%89%8C%E7%A5%96%E5%9D%9F/
Update:
https://youtu.be/6nkJHIMoW0w
https://youtu.be/weu4OfuL9jQ
似乎真係英國公司?

Windows上如果用唔到WASAPI/ASOI可以點?
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/ending-the-windows-audio-quality-debate.19438/

Ads

我係打手 2024-8-11 12:09:06 headphone推介(歡迎提供推介)
歡迎留言問下每隻個聲係點
為免偏見, 以下推介以英數字排序


Under 1k:
。he400se (open back, 平板)
。Hi-X15 (closed back)
。Hi-X50 (closed back)
。K240S/K240 mk II (open back)
。K701 (open back)
。MDR 7506 (closed back)
。SHP9600 (open back)
。SR60e (open back)
。SR80 (open back)
。srh440 (closed back)

1-2k:
。ATH-M50x (closed back)
。ATH-MSR7b (closed back)
。CD900ST (日本錄音室專用,只限日本販賣) (closed back)
。DT770Pro (closed back)
。DT990 Premium Limited-Edition Black (open back) (drop.com) (DT990 都係250ohm 以上好d)
。HD58X (open back) (drop.com)
。HD 6XX (即係HD650) (open back) (drop.com)
。HE4XX (open back, 平板) (drop.com)
。K712 (open back)
。X2HR (open back)

2-5k
。AH-D5200 (closed back)
:^(

。Amiron Home (open back)
。deva (open back, 平板)
。DROP + MRSPEAKERS ETHER CX CLOSED HEADPHONES (closed back, 平板)
。HI-X60 (closed back)
。HI-X65 (open back)
。Meze Audio 99 (closed back)
:^(

。Sundara (open back, 平板)
。th-500rp (open back, 平板)
。th-t60rp (semi-open back, 平板)

5k-10k
。Aeon 2 closed / Aeon 2 closed Noire (closed back, 平板)
。AH-D7200 (closed back)
。Ananda (open back, 平板)
。LCD2 closed back (closed back, 平板)
。Meze Audio 109 Pro (open back)
。SR-L500 mk2 + SRM-353x
:^(
(open back)
。T1 2nd (semi-open)
。T5 3rd (closed back)

10k以上
。AH-D9200 (closed back)
。Clear/ Clear professional/ Clear mg/ Clear mag professional (Focal) (open back)
。D8000/ D8000 pro/ D8000 pro black and gold (open back, 平板)
。Dan Clark Audio Stealth (closed back)
。edition 15
。K812 (open back)
。K872 (closed back)
。MDR-Z1R (closed back)
。Meze Audio liric (closed back)
。PS2000 (open back)
。Stellia (closed back)
。Utoopia (open back)
。ZMF Vérité closed/open

窮三代headphone:
。1266TC (open back, 平板)
。ADX5000 (open back)
。Arya (hifiman) (open back, 平板)
。Empyrean (open back, 平板)
。GS3000e (open back)
。HD800/ HD800s (open back)
。HE-1 (open back, 靜電)
。HE90 (open back, 靜電)
。he1000se (open back)
。HEDDphone (open back)
。K1000 (speaker)
。L3000 (closed back)
。L5000 (closed back)
。LCD4 (open back, 平板)
。MDR-R10 (open back)
。Omega (+ T2) (open back, 靜電)
。SR007Mk1 (open back, 靜電)
。SR009/ SR009s (open back, 靜電)
。SR1a (speaker, 鋁帶)
。suavara (open back, 平板)
。T1 90th (open back)
。T1 2nd (open back)
。X9000 (open back, 靜電)
我係打手 2024-8-11 12:09:24 on-ear推介(歡迎提供推介)
。KPH30i clear (open back)
。kph40(open back)
。Porta Pro (open back)

Headphone 架(歡迎提供推介)
。ADV. DUAL SUSPENSION HEADPHONE HANGER

AMP/ DAC + AMP推介(歡迎提供推介)
Under 2k:
。Fiio K5 Pro (Combo)
。ifi zen dac (Combo)
。ifi zen can (純AMP)
。JDS Lab Atom (純AMP)
。Schiit Magni (純AMP)
。Schiit vali (純AMP, 膽石混合)
。smsl SU8 (純DAC)
。Topping Dx3pro (Combo)

2-4k:
。aune s6 (Combo)
:^(

。Burson Play (Combo)
。dark voice 336se (膽純AMP)
。Element 2 (Combo)
:^(

。garage1217 project ember (純AMP, 膽石混合)
。Monolith by Monoprice Desktop Balanced Headphone Amplifier and DAC with THX AAA Technology (Combo)
。Schiit jotunheim 2 (純AMP)
。THX AAA 789 (純AMP), drop.com
。Topping D70 (純DAC)
。Pico power (純AMP)

4-10k
。ADI-2 DAC (Combo)
:^(

。AT-BHA100 (純AMP)
。Burson Soloist 3XP (純AMP)
。DA250 (Combo)
。DacMagic 200M (Combo)
。micro iDSD Black Label (Combo)
。Schiit Lyr (純膽AMP, OTL)
。美詩X3T (純AMP, 純膽amp)

10k以上
work in progress
。Burson conductor 3XR (Combo)
。Ferrum OOR + HYPSOS (純AMP)
。Ferrum Wandla + HYPSOS (純DAC)
。gsx mk2 (純AMP)
。gsx mini (純AMP)
。Linear Tube Audio MZ2 (膽純AMP, OTL)
。Moon 430Ha (純AMP)
。Nuprime amg-hpa (純AMP)
。SPL phonitor-xe, phonitor-x (純AMP)
。Violectric v222 (純AMP) (有巴打部v226爆咗整燒前端,v222同v226不過似乎未有呢個情況)
。wa22 (膽純AMP)
。Weiss DAC204 (純DAC)
。Weiss DAC501 (Combo)

電腦播放軟件推介(歡迎提供推介)
。Foobar 2000 (Windows)
免費,多人用,有唔同plugin 及theme
。jriver (Windows, Mac, Linux)
$79.98 US三平台,$59.98 US單平台
多人用,好聲過foobar
。TuneBrowser (Windows)
$3080 yen (約 $210港幣),平得黎好聲過foobar,有巴打話分析力好過jriver
。jplay (Windows)
€149.00
電腦播歌高級玩法,最複雜setup 要分2部PC,一部做decode,一部做control同storage
jplay本身有player,不過係headless,要用其他software如foobar/ jriver控制
。Roon
高質素升頻、multiroom support加media management系統,玩法多樣化而且方便,可以直接連streamer 出聲
lifetime billing: USD $829.99
Billed annually: USD $12 .49 / month
Billed monthly: USD $14 .99 / month
我係打手 2024-8-11 12:09:36 膽機相關
Credit: 豬油撈飯(NOS)
膽機分類 Transformer output (OPT)
用火牛去step down 部amp 輸出阻抗。可以用線路分類成單端、推挽、單端並聯。一般情況下,大部分耳牛使用單端線路已足夠推力應付。以下再介紹各款線路:
A. 單端放大電路(Single Ended) 全意是一支單端管 (例如 300B, 2A3 )以單一放大電路之意, 一部 Stereo 純單端機, 就只有兩支單端管。單端機種主要以音色為主, 動力為次, 無論播放哪一類型錄音都好, 高頻音色都很美, 整體音色艷麗嬌美。

:^(

(圖為一部單端2A3耳擴膽機)
B. 推挽放大電路 (Push Pull) 推挽式膽機後級放大管一般多用於 EL-34 ( 6CA7 ), 5881 ( 6L6 ), KT-88, 6550, 6V6, EL-84 ( 6BQ5 )等等, 選擇比單端機多, 推挽式放大電路必需要有逐行倒相制電路, 這份電路不易做出對稱的波形, 因此經過推挽級輸出的波形也絕不及單端電路波形對稱, 雖是如此, 但市場上推挽機較普及, 大部份中價機種都是推挽機居多, 好處是線路簡單, 功率足夠, 推動力較好, 音色具足夠厚度。

:^(

(圖為一部推挽45耳擴膽機)
C. 單端並聯(Parallel Single Ende)&並聯推挽 (Push Pull Parallel), 因為推挽波形不及單端而推出, 好處是集各項電路的優點加以改良而成,缺點係機種通常都做到好巨大。

:^(

(圖為一部並聯推挽 300B耳擴膽機)
膽機分類 Output transformerless (OTL)
不使用火牛,使用膽前後石或石前膽後純輸出
膽的內阻普遍比較大, 某些內阻最小的管子如三極管2A3之類的也要大幾百歐,如果不用變壓器去匹配阻抗,那傳遞給低阻喇叭/耳牛的功率會很小,大部分都消耗到膽內部了。所以膽機一般都要配輸出變壓器。OTL的意思就是不用輸出變壓器,那純膽輸出想OTL,就得多對膽並聯,一般要5對以上,甚至10對以上,才勉強可以跟喇叭/耳牛的阻抗相提並論。所以膽很少用OTL。電晶體內阻極低,遠小於喇叭/耳牛的阻抗。有的膽石機就采用前面電壓放大用膽,末級功率放大用晶體管 。由於使用電晶體,體積可以縮細, 適合空間鬥士。
:^(

(圖為一部OTL耳擴膽機)

OPT, OTL 各有好處,有人覺得OTL冇咗火牛所以會有最完全膽味,亦有人覺得OPT個火牛係「膽味」主要來源。
膽amp 同其他amp 一樣都有分pre amp, power amp,通常headphone amp 就合埋一齊一部過,係2 channel 界,合埋一部就叫合拼機。
上面講個3種分類都係用輸出(aka 後級, power amp)作為條件,自然就冇講前級 pre amp 個part 係點。實際上pre amp 呢part 唔會再特別分(你都可以話都係class A, class AB; balance, unbalance 呢d,不過都唔係膽機特有分類)
當你見部機得一款膽,不論一對定單支,可以肯定係Hybrid 先。至於個膽係用於前級定後級就要再睇。
而點解得一支膽,因為個支膽分類係dual triode膽,即係一粒有兩個放大元件,咁就可以一粒膽做曬左右channel。同樣concept 係op amp chip 都搵到,有d amp 用一粒op amp, 有d要2粒或以上,因為op amp chip 都有分係唔係「單邊」。

延伸去講,既然有d膽amp 前級都用一對膽,點解冇balance output?
技術上的確可以咁係,balance 都係放大4個signal, 一對dual triode膽夠做。不過其實好多時用一對膽做前級係想每個channel 嘅+ve signal copy 一份做返個common mode rejection, 減低膽噪。所以實際上唔會用-ve input
如果要咁樣每個input signal 獨立自己做common mode rejection,真正全平衡嘅膽機要4支dual triode膽先得。所以bha 100 要4支膽。
NORIP 2024-8-11 12:16:08 有乜 推薦?
我係打手 2024-8-11 12:21:23 巴打想搵乜?
Oh_Yeah 2024-8-11 12:57:10
:^(
我係打手 2024-8-11 13:23:16
:^(
nokia安全套 2024-8-11 13:25:59
:^(
我係打手 2024-8-11 13:26:45
:^(
nokia安全套 2024-8-11 13:27:50
:^(

Ads

darkcl 2024-8-11 14:02:49
:^(
我係打手 2024-8-11 14:07:59
:^(
假塑膠樹 2024-8-11 14:29:52 去完鐵三角試完adx5000有啲興趣添…
定係msb嘅威力?
:^(
的士文 2024-8-11 14:40:43
:^(
darkcl 2024-8-11 14:41:55
:^(
hj2qbjds 2024-8-11 14:49:06
:^(
起身遲咗 得返3個鐘 都係唔去了
的士文 2024-8-11 14:50:56
:^(
羊喵喵 2024-8-11 17:18:26 fostex 隻新closed back係壞咗定點
咁難聽嘅
我係打手 2024-8-11 18:00:24 open個隻都麻麻
:^(
NORIP 2024-8-11 18:16:39 膽機耳擴

Ads

我係打手 2024-8-11 18:17:17 用咩headphone?
budget?
NORIP 2024-8-11 18:19:11 AKG K812

2皮以下 可以接受
NORIP 2024-8-11 18:20:32 我喺亞馬遜都睇咗好多 選擇唔係太多,好多都係大陸嘅
nokia安全套 2024-8-11 18:28:04 呢個budget外國牌子選擇唔多
或者試下d入門機先例如schiit lyr (前膽後石)如果要全膽擴大部分都係國內牌子